DG announces the other speakers for the conference on Think: The Life of the Mind & the Love of God:

* Al Mohler – “The Way the World Thinks: Meeting the Natural Mind in the Mirror and in the Market Place”
* Rick Warren – “Thinking Purposefully for the Glory of Christ: The Life of the Mind and Global Reality”
* R. C. Sproul (via video) – “Thinking Deeply in the Ocean of Revelation: The Bible and the Life of the Mind”
* Thabiti Anyabwile – “Thinking for the Sake of Global Faithfulness: Confronting Islam with the Mind of Christ”
* Francis Chan – “Think Hard, Stay Humble: The Life of the Mind and the Peril of Pride”
* John Piper – “Thinking for the Sake of Joy: The Life of the Mind and the Love of God”

And here’s the video from last night on Warren:

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Comments:


78 thoughts on “Piper on Warren, the Think Conference, and the Other Speakers”

  1. David says:

    First comment! (of many I expect)

  2. Andrew Faris says:

    “Yes” a million times. This is a remarkably wise 12 minutes of talking. No kidding, this is one of my favorite things I’ve ever seen/read from Piper because of how incisively wise it is. He has clearly not been negligent or thoughtless for the sake of either false unity or strong denouncement. I’m quite impressed.

    Andrew Faris
    Christians in Context

    1. sean leroy says:

      I couldn’t agree with you more…I think it’s particularly helpful – or will be – to those w/i the reformed community seeing one of their own process and work within his own parameters/convictions.

  3. Thank you for being so thoughtful Pastor John, walking us through your thought process is so helpful.

  4. Wayne Foil says:

    It is good to learn that Warren is not as bad as some of us imagined him to be. But does that make him the best choice, if the number of conference speakers is limited? Is Warren’s popularity reason enough for this choice?

    1. sean leroy says:

      You should re-listen to what John said…

  5. MatthewS says:

    Wow. This is moving. May I be this enthusiastic about those with whom I have disagreements!!

    From Hamlet:
    POLONIUS: My lord, I will give them all they deserve.
    HAMLET: Good heavens, man, give them more than that! If you pay everyone what they deserve, would anyone ever escape a whipping? Treat them with honor and dignity.
    The less they deserve, the more your generosity is worth. Lead them inside.

    There is something very powerful about treating others with respect, even more respect than someone might feel like they deserve, particularly those with whom you have substantial disagreements.

    Piper appears to have made a real connection with Warren and has a personal appreciation for him.

    He is modeling something very powerful about building bridges and about secondary separation and about how to identify core issues and not be excessively separatist.

    I think he is actively demonstrating the fruit of the Spirit in dealing with another brother. Piper here is more gracious to Warren than I tend to be to Piper and I am convicted.

  6. Aaron says:

    As much as Warren makes me uneasy, I really appreciate Piper’s approach and attitude on this issue. It’s humbling and causes me to do introspection.

  7. Dan Hagan says:

    If we were to apply “secondary separation” to Jesus Christ we’d all be in big trouble! ;-)

    All I have to say is I trust implicitly Pastor Piper’s judgment!

    Besides, all pastors need pastors of their own…!

    1. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

      If we were to apply “secondary separation” to Jesus Christ we’d all be in big trouble! ;-)

      Yowsa!!! That’s a major, major point.

      BTW, John Piper invited Albert Mohler to speak at his Desiring God conference. And horror of horrors, Albert Mohler signed… oh my gosh, it’s so hard to write this, (let me softly whisper this) Albert Mohler signed the Manhattan Declaration. Can you believe it?

      If the folks who are steamed at Piper for inviting Rick Warren, then mayhaps they are steamed too at Piper for not practicing secondary separation from Albert Mohler who supports the sanctity of life, biblical marriage, and religious liberty as stated in the Manhattan Declaration.

      Ohhhh.. aaaaah… waaaaaah, what is the DG conference coming to? Piper is so compromising the purity of it all. Rick Warren invited. And now an invitation to a Manhattan Declaration supporter and defender in Albert Mohler. How sad.

      1. Lol. TUAD, you kill me. I think you have some form of Turrets syndrome in your comments. It’s as though every third comment or so has to exclaim “Manhattan Declaration!”

        1. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

          I must be slackin’. It’s supposed to be every two comments where I slip in something about the Manhattan Declaration.

          BTW Brad, you crack me up too. I’m getting a kick at seeing Dan Phillips and Fred Butler taking turns doing elbow drops on your nose in that dispensationalist thread at Bibchr. Your nose must be flat by now.

          1. I have a very resilient schnoz.

    2. Jean says:

      “All I have to say is I trust implicitly Pastor Piper’s judgment!”

      Dan- I like John Piper Lots! His books have been a great help to me
      but we need to be careful on thinking any man’s judgment is all wise. I think John’s intentions are very good but his judgment can be influenced by all kinds of faulty and even sinful thinking like any other man.

  8. Gavin Brown says:

    This is surprising. I really have an immense amount of respect and admiration for John Piper, and I am not a fundy, or watchblog type, etc. But…I am surprised that Dr. Piper has invited Warren to DG, because whether intended or not, many, many reformed folks will view this as an endorsement of Warrren’s ministry, and be inclined to view Warren’s books, ministry model, methodology, etc., in a more positive light simply because Piper has given his stamp of approval.

    Also bothersome was Dr. Piper arguing that the public’s perception of Warren, based on his social justice efforts and “The Purpose Driven Life,” were not accurate, because Warren told him that he reads Edwards and gave satisfactory answers to his questions. And? Should people not form an view of Rick Warren based on his published material, conferences, or his global ministry efforts?

    1. Andrew Faris says:

      Gavin,

      What is the problem with the book and, even more, the social justice ministry?

      Andrew Faris
      Christians in Context

      1. Gavin Brown says:

        Andrew,

        This will sound as if I’m dodging your question, but I really don’t want to engage that subject. It is not that I don’t have (what I believe to be) an informed opinion, I just don’t want to go there.

        In fact, I don’t think Warren will say anything outrageous or heretical (I could be wrong). My only concern was the effect this sort of move has on the larger reformed community, many of whom believe most of what comes out of John Piper’s mouth (which is a testament to Piper’s character and ministry). Already in this comment thread this is evident.

        But I’m not about trashing Rick Warren. I just can’t see how this is a good move. But everyone is entitles to an opinion.

  9. David says:

    It’s true Gavin. I’m sure Piper never thought of that before inviting Warren. :P

    1. Gavin Brown says:

      David, I’m sure he did. Piper is a very careful minister. This is why I am surprised. And I’m not hating on Piper, I love the guy. I’m just scratching my head a bit here.

      1. Ben says:

        I agree with you. I am scratching my head as well. Why would Piper invite Warren? Yes, yes, I watched the videos. It still does not make sense. All of the sudden we overlook all of the wrongs of Warren and prop him up (of all things!) as a man of doctrine?

  10. Jake Meador says:

    A thousand thousand amens. Outstanding.

  11. DJ says:

    Warren’s tweet from yesterday:

    “I think it is best not to allow myself to laugh at the faults, follies,& infirmities of others” Jonathan Edwards,1773

    Wise counsel for us, no?

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  13. I realize that in today’s 24 hour media cycle it is hard to remember things last week, let alone over a year. But here is video of Rick Warren telling lies about his support for California’s Proposition 8. I paid careful attention to this since I live in this Liberal Mecca on the West coast. This ought to bear on this discussion.

  14. Surprised says:

    As a lover of God’s word, Desiring God’s ministry, & Dr. Piper’s teaching I have to admit I am a little mystified. As one who has heard Dr. Warren, pastored in the shadow of Saddleback, and seen firsthand the effects of his so called discipleship I would have to disagree with Warren’s assessment of his own ministry. I’ve always said Warren & Saddleback Church is not as bad as many make it out to be, but worse than most know. Simply put, I am afraid his answers to Dr. Piper’s questions do not line up with the reality of what he actually teaches & how those in his flock are ministered too.
    BTW, due to my wife’s brief involvement in the church many years ago, my family was considered “members” of Saddleback Church until just recently. This is despite the fact that I am a pastor of another church and on numerous occasions asked them to remove us from their records (so you will have to excuse skepticism)
    That being said, Pastor John–can’t wait to see & hear you at T4G!

  15. Gary Fox says:

    Piper clearly has done this for a reason…he was obviously not clueless regarding how shocking and teeth rattling this would be for (as Driscoll refers to them) the “tighty-whity calvinsists”. My hunch is that he did this to stir up our thinking and to help us prevent stagnation…my hunch is that he knew this would provoke a buzz and indeed it has!

    Now we’re talking about a whole new dynamic of the “Church being The Church”…and I think so much self righteousness is being exposed as well…I even saw it in me initially when I read about this…I thought, “WHAT?!?!?!?!”

    That old man Piper is clever and wise…

  16. Bruce Russell says:

    Isn’t Piper really saying that he is separating from evangelicals with convictions concerning pastoral ministry, baptism and mega-church pragmatism like multiple site video preaching?

  17. David says:

    Dang. This would be like 2pac inviting The Notorious B.I.G. to freestyle with him. :P

    But honestly people, is this really any worse than if Piper had invited Billy Graham for example? I think Graham is misguided in areas but I don’t think he’s a liberal or a heretic. He loves God and he’s been in the trenches longer than most of us have been lobbing blog comments. I think the same goes for Warren.

    1. Trenton says:

      Amen David.

      I’m praying for a sick West v. Mid-west rap battle during the conference.

    2. DH says:

      Was it not Graham who responded (in so many words) to Larry King’s questions, that Hell maybe be a metaphor/figurative? that God has another way to heaven for the Jews?

      Graham rallied support from people who did not personally believe the Gospel.

      1. Russ says:

        I’m no fan of Warren (haven’t read much of anything save PDL), but why does he have to come out and give his position on those topics? He’s been invited to the conference, accepted and will be there. Not sure he owes anything to anyone, especially those within the (wait for it, this will be shocking…..) the BLOGOSPHERE.

  18. Rob says:

    Why does Warren not come out and make his OWN positions clear on Penal Substitution/ Women Elders/ Repentance/ Emergence= Liberalism/ Total Depravity?
    Why does John Piper have to do this for him?
    Every man needs to win the consciences of others before they have the right to teach them. Warren has obviously won John’s conscience in one or two conversations. Time will tell if he is wise in presenting him to others as a credible teacher of the Word of God.

    1. Russ says:

      Sorry, the comment above was towards your comment. I hit the wrong reply button. I’m a blog rookie…..

      1. Jean says:

        I guess he owes it to the church (at large)to be clear on these and other biblical issues. If he is going to teach Christ’s flock then he also owes it to the Head of the Church to be clear on these matters also.
        Its a pity we are all finding out how true to Scripture Rick Warren is from the mouth of John Piper… would have been better if the church (at large) knew of his fidelity to the Solas etc from his own writings and sermons.
        I have always found it dangerous to speak up for someone who I know just a little. I hope for John’s sake this is as wise a move as some on here assume it is.

        1. Russ says:

          Sorry, Jean. I have to disagree. The only Person that Rick Warren is ultimately accountable to is Jesus Christ. Yes, he is accountable to the ruling elders as well as to his congregation, but it would be more of a knock on his congreagation if he was teaching unbiblical doctrine and he still had a full church.

  19. Rick Warren is considered a friend of Brian McLaren. I have heard Warren say that the Liberal and Fundamentalist views are both right on the Charlie Rose Show. Sorry but since when is the view that man is basically good just as right as the view of man being inherently sinful?

  20. James says:

    I am so dissapointed in Piper. Why does he keep speaking a about “pragmatism” as a good thing? “Pragamatism” is unbiblical, it’s about as unbiblical as “humanism” or any other Godless philosophy.

    If he would have invited Warren to do a sit down talk for an hour on these issues it would have been o.k. But no, Piper gives him the pulpit so he can share his views.

    Many of us young restless and Reformed types came out of the soft weak affeminite “seeker sensitive” churches. We came out becuase the 40 days of purpose for your church program does not work, and it divides.

    Oh yeah and to all of you out there comparing John Piper and Warren to Whitefield and Wesley, shut up already. Warren is not Wesley, not at all. I can’t imagine Wesley being seeker sensitive Warren is an honest man who might have good zeal, and I would rather have him as my congressman or senator than as my pastor. Warren’s whole weak approach to evangelism irks me, its sick to try to like to be loved by everyone. Just listen to any of his appearances on television, he’s soft and overly apologetic and won’t take a clear stand on the gospel.

    This is a joke.

    1. Andrew Faris says:

      James,

      Coming on a tad strong, no?

      Especially considering that Piper is specifically saying that Warren’s pragmatism is a bad thing. You’ve pretty seriously misunderstood Piper in this respect. The pragmatism is why Piper was skeptical.

      Andrew Faris
      Christians in Context

      1. James says:

        Faris, I don’t think that weak evangelism should be supported in any way. I saw a clip of Warren give an invitation for people to pray the sinner’s prayer, and then he said “you don’t even have to pray out loud cuz God knows what you’re thinking.”

        I am no fan of the sinner’s prayer, but seriously if you are going to do an invitation like that then call people to repentance. I defy you or anyone else to look at his appearances on any talkshow and tell me that he clearly articulated the gospel with the courage and power of the Holy Spirit. Compare Warren’s television appearances with those of John MacArthur or even Franklin
        Graham and then tell me they are the same.

      2. James says:

        About the pragmatism thing, Maybe your right, but why would Piper say that Warren’s “church discipline” and disclipleship are great?

        1. Andrew Faris says:

          I’m pretty confident that I am right on Piper’s view of Warren’s pragmatism. His point, regarding the stuff you brought up, is that at least according to Warren, they’re serious at Saddelback about membership, discipleship, and discipline. So Warren may not express that especially well- I certainly don’t think he does- but he does at least take it seriously enough that he tries to do it.

          This is the thing: whatever Warren’s faults (and again, don’t get me wrong: I think he has plenty of them), I’m confident at least that he is orthodox, whether he expresses that well or not. I’m confident that he could sign the belief statement at your church gladly. So he may deserve some rebuke for how he lives those out in the public eye, and that’s a serious thing. But he doesn’t deserve rebuke as a heretic or a preacher of a different gospel. I’d say that his biggest problem comes when he tries to articulate the gospel with non-theological terms (read the piece from Modern Ref that JT posted on that) in a winsome way, and it ends up sounding watered down. One hopes that anyone who comes to Christ through such imperfect gospel presentation grows enough in Christ to see where the picture is deeper and more colorful.

          Andrew Faris
          Christians in Context

  21. Terry says:

    That video is one more reason to respect John Piper.

  22. Keith says:

    What if God is using Piper and the gang to ‘reform’ Warren?

    1. Timbo says:

      Keith, we cannot afford to take that chance. [/sarcasm]

      Imagine if Christ responded to our sinful depravity the way that so many people here are responding to Warren’s “doctrinal depravity”.

      1. Jean says:

        As sinners we are loved due to Christ’s grace. The only standard we need to meet is that we are needy sinners.

        As teachers of the flock of God there is a whole different set of standards. 1 Tim.3/ Titus 1.

        You cannot equate the two.

        1. Timbo says:

          Nor can you completely separate the two. The grace Christ has shown to us should be evident in our dealings with others. So many of the comments here do not have an ounce of that grace.

          1. Solaguy says:

            “many.. not an ounce of grace..”
            Could you list five for me?
            I just see Christians expressing their legitimate concerns and disagreements with the wisdom of having John Piper bring Rick Warren to the platform God has given him.
            Graceless? Must be reading a different page from me.

            1. Timbo says:

              According to comments in the initial blog post, Rick Warren…

              “preaches a different gospel”
              “absolutely sickening”
              “distorts the Gospel”
              “destructive teaching”
              “bad company” “corrupts”

              But my favorite one so far…

              “a Gospel-betraying, Bible-hating evildoer”

              I fail to see an ounce of grace in any of these remarks, and the general tenor of so many other comments is that Piper is doing something evil by inviting Warren to his conference.

    2. Jean says:

      That would be great!!
      But is it wise to have such a developing relationship out in public. Would it have been wiser for John to spend a couple of years “hanging out” with RW before he sets him before the Christian Community as a man who should be listened to?

    3. Keith says:

      I’m not talking about Piper’s motivation. And it appears that Piper has given Warren a ‘safe’ topic for him to stay tethered to the truth.

      But what if God is providentially using these men to sway Warren to the true gospel of faith and repentance. I’m not saying this is the way man should go about commending the truth…to give a platform. But maybe God is using a simple conference to initiate the reformation in this man’s life.

      Maybe?

      1. Keith,

        No matter what the outcome, whether for mercy or for judgment, we can be sure that God is providentially using these men and this situation. However, the argument, “God’s using it, so it must be OK,” confuses God’s will of decree with His will of precept.

        The example I used in the other thread was Balaam’s donkey. God certainly used Balaam’s donkey. There’s no question. But I don’t think it’s a good idea to sit at the feet of donkeys for Biblical teaching. In fact, God even used Balaam himself, and later on in Scripture Balaam is explicitly referred to as a false prophet who loved the wages of unrighteousness, and is compared to Cain and Korah the rebel.

        The effect that God’s sovereign, providential control of all things should have on us is to put all of our faith and trust in Him and not in man. That Piper invited Warren should not rock our world, make us crumble, or make us fear. But just because God has sovereignly ordained these events doesn’t mean that they’re not unwise or even sinful on the part of men, who are responsible even in view of God’s sovereignty.

        1. Keith says:

          I agree Mike…totally!

          Do you believe Warren preaches a false gospel?

  23. Andy Chance says:

    I very much respect John Piper’s opinion.

    And I think Rick Warren is a Christian brother.

    And I’ve always thought that Warren was a person with very good intentions and was very skilled at putting plans into action.

    And I had already read in other places about his sound doctrinal positions.

    And I think that he must be extraordinarily gifted to lead such a large church.

    And I’m sure many people have come to Christ through his church.

    And in his area, I’m sure that his church has done many, many good things.

    And I would love to go eat lunch with Rick Warren. I’m sure he’s a great guy to be around, and we could all learn a lot from him.

    But I can think of no other single person who has done more to degrade preaching in the United States than Rick Warren. For over a decade, he has influenced pastors to preach topical, felt-needs sermons over biblical, expository sermons. I think that’s hurt a lot of people. That is why I would never ask him speak at my church or conference.

    But at the same time, it’s not my church or conference. Piper can ask whomever he wants. And I would still eat with John Piper. In face, I would eat with John Piper or Rick Warren, at the same time or separately. I would even pick up the tab.

  24. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

    Headless chickens running and flapping all over the courtyard, squawking and clucking:

    “Piper invited Warren! Piper invited Warren! Piper invited Warren!”

    Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk! Bawk!

    1. Jean says:

      :-)
      oops… sorry… I thought we were on a forum discussing the invitation Piper gave to Warren.

      Are you showing intolerance towards those, who while loving Piper and much of his writing, are concerned that on this action he is showing a lack of wisdom?
      Are you trying to shut down the discussion by mocking those who have a disagreement with piper on this issue?

    2. Gavin Brown says:

      That is not helpful.

  25. John says:

    When USA Today asked Warren why Mormon and Jewish leaders are involved in his pastoral training programs, Rick Warren reportedly said, “I’m not going to get into a debate over the non-essentials. I won’t try to change other denominations. Why be divisive?” (USA Today, July 21, 2003). Rick Warren endorses a host of books, from New Age authors to Emergent writers to conservative evangelicals.

    1. Scott says:

      Before condemning someone, it might be a good idea to see if what “they reportedly said” is actually true! But don’t let that stop you from your doctrinal ploice work!

      1. John says:

        Are you accusing me of lying Scott?

  26. Andrew says:

    This kerfuffle seems a little silly. Certainly a Reformed person would have some disagreements with Rick Warren. As a specifically Presbyterian Reformed person, I would have some disagreements with … gasp … John Piper. But I still value (immensely!) John Piper’s writing and preaching ministry. The big dividing line in this debate seems to be between those who view any encounter with an opposing viewpoint (even the opposing viewpoint of a brother in Christ) as dangerous and those who see value in critically engaging – in public – an opposing viewpoint for mutual growth and edification. It seems to me that the latter view is one that will help Christians – both pastors and laypeople – grow.

    As an earlier comment said, if you disagree with JP extending an invitation to Rick Warren, just don’t go to the conference. This is one of those areas where the gospel frees us to chill the heck out from the burden of always attaining perfect theological precision. It is Jesus who saves us and not our doctrinal perfection.

    1. Ben says:

      Andrew, we would disagree with your evaluation. There is ample evidence that Warren does not build ministries on doctrine, but on PR. He does not stand for the truth when asked doctrinal questions on national media. Compare MacArthur to Warren on national TV! It is odd that Piper had to be the one to inform us all what Warren believes. He had to call him up and ask him!! Why not read RW’s books to find out. Oh, wait, there is no way to find out his doctrinal positions in his books. That is the point, Andrew. Warren is not known for being about doctrine. Piper admits it ini the first video, but then does an about-face and tells us in the second video that Warren is a man of doctrine. There is a huge disconnect with what Piper teaches and this latest development. It is very sad. Truly sad.

  27. mike mileski says:

    funny that JP discussed RW on gender distinctions before repentance. let’s get some perspective here.

  28. Charles says:

    What a kick in the stomach.

    Dr. Piper, have you become “too big to fail”?

    What blessing has God withheld from you, your ministry and your reputation that you find it necessary to clasp hands with a Gospel-betraying, Bible-hating evildoer?

    1. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

      I’m for freedom of speech and all, but Charles, in the same vein and name of freedom of speech that’s granted to me as well, your comment is just waaaaaay over the top.

      Your comment says more bad stuff about you than it does about Piper or Rick Warren.

      1. TUAD, I agree with you, but you were the guy just bawking like a chicken.

        1. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

          No, I was saying the folks up in arms over Piper’s invitation of Warren are bawking like chickens.

          1. John says:

            Your childish.

            1. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

              You’re childish.

              1. John says:

                That’s what I’m talking about.

              2. Truth Unites... and Divides says:

                And that’s what I’m talking about.

  29. Christopher Benson says:

    I am disappointed by John Piper’s backhanded compliments of Rick Warren in this video. Here is a close paraphrase:

    [Rick Warren] said something that piqued my interest, “I read everything you have written,” which I did not believe and considered to be an overstatement. That he read anything surprised me. Then he said, “I am in the middle of one of my yearly treks through one theologian. I have read half of the Yale collected works of Jonathan Edwards. And I plan to finish them by the end of the year.” I thought, you have gotta be kiddin.’ You don’t come across to anybody as a lover of Jonathan Edwards. You are Mr. Pragmatist.

    Perhaps I am misreading these remarks, but they seem self-interested (focused on Piper’s writing and Piper’s favorite theologian) and condescending (expressing shock at Warren’s intelligent reading habits).

    The rest of the video makes up for these backhanded compliments, but they perhaps reveal “the species of pride” that Piper wants to address during his eight-month sabbatical. I am glad to see that Piper is reaching out beyond the cloister of Reformed folks to find fellowship with Warren. Both men elicit my admiration.

  30. David Hovis says:

    From “Brothers, We Must Not Mind a Little Suffering: Meditations on the Life of Charles Simeon” by John Piper, April 15, 1989:

    Simeon to John Wesley:

    “Sir, I understand that you are called an Arminian; and I have been sometimes called a Calvinist; and therefore I supposes we are to draw daggers. But before I consent to begin the combat, with your permission I will ask you a few questions. Pray, Sir, do you feel yourself a depraved creature, so depraved that you would never have thought of turning to God, if God had not first put it into your heart?”

    “Yes, I do indeed.”

    “And do you utterly despair of recommending yourself to God by anything you can do; and look for salvation solely through the blood and righteousness of Christ?”

    “Yes, solely through Christ.”

    “But, Sir, supposing you were at first saved by Christ, are you not somehow or other to save yourself afterwards by your own works?”

    “No, I must be saved by Christ from first to last.”

    “Allowing, then, that you were first turned by the grace of God, are you not in some way or other to keep yourself by your own power?”

    “No.”

    “What then, are you to be upheld every hour and every moment by God, as much as an infant in its mother’s arms?”

    “Yes, altogether.”

    “And is all your hope in the grace and mercy of God to preserve you unto His heavenly kingdom?”

    “Yes, I have no hope but in Him.”

    “Then, Sir, with your leave I will put away my dagger again; for this is all my Calvinism; this is my election, my justification by faith, my final perseverance: it is in substance that I hold, and as I hold it; and therefore if you please, instead of searching out the terms and phrases to be a ground of contention between us, we will cordially unite in those things wherein we agree.” (Moule, 79f).

  31. James says:

    To to all of you out there comparing John Piper and Warren to Whitefield and Wesley, shut up already. Warren is not Wesley, not at all. I can’t imagine Wesley being seeker sensitive. Warren is an honest man who might have good zeal, and I would rather have him as my congressman or senator than as my pastor. Warren’s whole weak approach to evangelism irks me, its sick to try to like to be loved by everyone. Just listen to any of his appearances on television, he’s soft and overly apologetic and won’t take a clear stand on the gospel.

    This is a joke.

  32. Steve Treichler says:

    Good job, John!! I really like that you are shaking things up by asking someone out of the normal reformed bubble. I like Rick Warren, not for his tight doctrine, but his incredibly simple devotion to Jesus and the lost. You are a man of courage, John Piper! Do not let other bully you out of what you need to do.

  33. Andy says:

    Everyone –

    John Piper does not care what you think of Rick Warren.

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