I really enjoyed this conversation with Pastor Zack Eswine, author of the important book Sensing Jesus: Life and Ministry as a Human Being. I would encourage you to watch it, especially if you are in pastoral ministry or hope to be (though it is applicable to all of us).

We talk about burnout—for example, the world’s definition of greatness as “large, notable, and now” vs. Jesus’ teaching of “small things, slowly, over a long period of time,” along with the temptation of pastors to pretend as if they are omniscient (know it all), omnipotent (fix it all), or omnipresent (be everywhere at once).

I tried to draw out why he thinks remembering our humanity is important, and one thing he said stood out to me: “When I’m holding the Bible to pray with someone, I’m doing it with coffee breath. Even if we have a revival . . . and it went into the night, at some point we still have to go to the bathroom.”

You can watch the whole conversation here: